thanks phil-- your message just reminded me of some confusing terminology that may need clarification along the way. i'm probaly not clarifing much in this message. i won't fully explore the possibilities, but, may give some of those interested in cell biology something to be aware of... "test tube baby" usually used to describe in vitro fertilized eggs which are then transferred to a mother's uterus to grow full term without a mother they wouldn't be able to develop properly the test tube stay is just days beyond a certain point the few cells of the "embryo" become a "tissue culture" of "stem cells" if caught at the right stage this is the fate of "excess embryos" typically generated by the in vitro fertilization process if not left frozen indefinitely or discarded. possibly there needs to be a different word for this stage of a cell mass--"test tube embryo"--i don't know... it will never really be a baby with a fully diverse and developed form "clone" this word gets kicked around nowadays and has many meanings. strictly speaking -- in tissue culture practice it refers to cultures that originate from one cell or to tissues that arose from one cell there were dfferent ways of isolating one cell in oncocytogenetics we used to characterize neoplasia chromosome complements to follow the evolution of a tumor through time as it changed and mutated into new tumors what i just said gives you no clue to the human suffering that preceeded each new tissue sample "clone" also refers to some sci fi stuff that the general public thinks of first not the cells under a microscope that will never remotely resemble a human being in another context, it may refer to just another technique of produceing an in vitro "test tube baby" which is little different from what has been going on for years "Therapeutic Cloning" a catch all phrase/ ray ps is the bottom line-- about respect for human life, and with that, trying to eradicate forms of suffering? the terminology chosen can be critical to forms of understanding and communication choose wisely i've got to go now this is the tip of an iceberg to me Phil Tompkins wrote: > > Some recent news articles and TV reports about stem cell > research will be confusing to members of the public who haven't > been following the subject closely, and will likely result in > uninformed opinions about the source of embryonic stem cells and > the legitimacy of the research. Like so much of the fleeting sound > bites that pass for "news", there is a focus on controversy so as to > get reader or audience attention, but essential background and > clarifying facts are omitted, leaving much to the imagination. > Ray Strand Prairie Sky Design -----------------( on the Edge of the Prairie Abyss )--------------- when the sky is clear the ground is visible 49/dx PD 2 yrs/40? onset/retired