Hi Ginny!
StFX does not have an English requirement. Some departments in the
Sciences division "strongly recommend" a writing-based pair in Arts, but
it is not mandatory.
How's that survey coming????????
Wendy
Wendy L. Kraglund-Gauthier
Academic Skills Instructor
Camden Hall 113
(902) 867-4530
[log in to unmask] www.stfx.ca/people/wkraglun
The Writing Centre, StFX University
Antigonish, NS B2G 2W5
-----Original Message-----
From: CASLL/Inkshed [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Virginia Ryan
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 11:58 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Writing/Literature Requirements
Sandy Dorley wrote:
>Tom--you are right in saying that the colleges are different from the
universities and that they often serve different student populations--of
course by saying that we are ignoring the many university students who
come to the college AFTER their degrees to get "practical" training in
their field or to retrain in another because they have not been able to
get jobs.
>
>However, Betsy quite rightly articulated my reason for responding to
her and Ginny. They asked about college and university practices.
Since so many of the CASLL people are university faculty, I felt that I
could offer a rather unique perspective for their study.
>
>By the way, the colleges in Ontario, as I pointed out in my posting,
are now granting bachelor degrees--4 year degrees which are a
combination of focused curricular courses in addition to a percentage of
Liberal studies courses. The Ontario college bachelor's program has
been in effect now for two years, and they seem to be filling a gap for
certain university programs that do not have enough space for students.
>
>Professor Sandy Dorley
>School of Liberal Studies
>Conestoga College, Kitchener, ON
>519-748-5220 x3819
>[log in to unmask]
>
>
>
>
>>>>[log in to unmask] 11/02/04 12:22AM >>>
>>>>
>>>>
>Tom, I wasn't quite sure I understood what your worry was--I thought
>Sandy's post was quite clear, that she was describing the writing
>requirements at the two places she knew firsthand in Ontario, both of
them
>clearly named and both of them clearly not universities. Since I'm
>interested in getting information about writing requirements at all
>post-secondary institutions in Canada, Sandy's information was helpful.
Am
>I missing something here? Betsy Sargent
>
>
>At 02:53 PM 10/31/2004, you wrote:
>
>
>>No offense. Community colleges are not the same as universities.
Both
>>structurally and academically, community colleges are different. The
fact
>>that community colleges cannot grant a formal academic degree (almost
all
>>the time without affiliation with a university [religious colleges are
>>excluded]), it has to do with everything (pure academic aspects and
>>quality). Further, the admission requirements of community colleges
are
>>quite different from
>>universities. The topic of English requirements in Ontario
universities
>>should not and cannot be compared with community colleges. They are
>>different in zillions of ways. Tom William
>>
>>Sandy Dorley wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>At the risk of repeating myself, I'll speak for the writing
>>>
>>>
>>requirements at two Ontario Colleges.
>>
>>
>>>At George Brown College in Toronto, the requirement is 3 writing
>>>
>>>
>>courses for MOST programs. The first course is an essay writing
course
>>(traditional composition course). Technical programs then have two
more
>>courses--Tech Writing I which focuses on short works (memo, email,
>>letter, etc.) and Tech Writing II which focuses on writing the formal
>>report. Business students have similar business writing classes in
>>place--1 or 2 depending on the program.
>>
>>
>>>Students are placed in either remedial or regular composition classes
>>>
>>>
>>by a writing sample and grammar/editing test that they take before the
>>start of classes. The second and third classes have no ESL
equivilent,
>>so students are all lumped together.
>>
>>
>>>As usual, some programs choose to ignore either the number of classes
>>>
>>>
>>or co-opt them and have a program member give some job related writing
>>instruction. I left there in 2002, and the remedial composition
course
>>was under fire--many faculty in the programs were trying to eliminate
it
>>and one of two technical writing courses to make more program courses.
>>
>>
>>>At Conestoga College in Kitchener, we have two writing
>>>
>>>
>>streams--technical and business. Again, not all programs have all
these
>>courses, but most follow this pattern. Business and Social Science
>>fields have 2 courses--Professional writing I which concentrates on
>>business letter writing, and Professional writing II which teaches the
>>formal report. All of the work is done with case studies and has a
>>specific slant towards the program field.
>>
>>
>>>Technical programs have only 1 course--Effective Technical
>>>
>>>
>>Communications. It teaches technical letters, memos, descriptions,
etc.
>>but no formal report.And again, the examples are from the technical
field
>>of the students. It means a lot of subsidizing the work in the texts.
>>
>>
>>>We don't really have a true remedial course, but we do add 1 extra
hour
>>>
>>>
>>per week to the regular first business course for ESL students or
those
>>who show a real weakness in writing. Business/social science students
>>must give a writing sample before the start of the semester that is
used
>>to place them in the regular or expanded class.
>>
>>
>>>We have no placement in tech writing. All students in the program
must
>>>
>>>
>>take the writing class before graduating. We are starting to get a
lot
>>of second language students, and this course is even more difficult
for
>>them than the other students.
>>
>>
>>>Now with the coming of the 4 year applied degrees, there are some
>>>
>>>
>>changes. We have 3 degrees up and running at Conestoga, and they all
>>require technical writing--usually two classes per program. So far,
the
>>policy is to put 1 or 2 dedicated writing courses in each degree
program.
>>
>>
>>>Hope this helps, Ginny.
>>>
>>>Professor Sandy Dorley
>>>School of Liberal Studies
>>>Conestoga College, Kitchener, ON
>>>519-748-5220 x3819
>>>[log in to unmask]
>>>
>>>
>>>
Thank you to both Tom and Sandy for entering the discussion - and to
everyone else who so far has done so. And I do understand the
distinctions you point out, Tom, and I will of course be keeping them in
mind when assessing what I've gathered. Like Betsy, though, I requested
information about "English" requirements in both Canadian colleges
_and_ universities - and I'm still hoping to hear from others who work
in either kind of institution.
I'm also hoping that it will stop raining here in Newfoundland, one of
these months ... :-(
Ginny Ryan
Memorial University of Newfoundland
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