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Hi Carole, this is why I'm pushing for a discussion. My high school students used to do it, why can't we? I think the folks with the IVF connection have an interesting and valuable take on it. Ray---- Original Message ----- From: "Ted Menser" <[log in to unmask]> To: <[log in to unmask]> Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 8:02 AM Subject: Re: 60 Minutes Surplus Embryo Report page 1/Carole > Hi Ray -- > I guess everyone has their hot button issues. I wish someone would hit on > something that could bring the sides closer together -- or at least be a > strong talking point. As you point out, there needs to be some forceful > and > respected voices to help clarify some of the issues. Like with that > statement about Social Security, things get way off a lot of times and > before you know it, the arguments are just plain ridiculous. Everyone has > to follow their own conscience but I hope there will be more > enlightenment --on both sides-- about some of the polarizing issues. > > Carole > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "rayilynlee" <[log in to unmask]> > To: <[log in to unmask]> > Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 11:12 AM > Subject: Re: 60 Minutes Surplus Embryo Report page 1/Carole > > >> Carole, I think this is definitely one of the objections. They suffer >> from >> what I call the "fear of Frankenstein syndrome" . The slippery slope >> objection which is fed by the Hwang fiasco., movies and books. Also, I >> think that mixing it with the abortion issue will make it easier to >> overturn >> Roe v. Wade. >> >> Last night I had discussion with my tax guy, a "moderate Republican" who >> favors ESCR and a woman's right to choose. I couldn't get a word in, but >> he >> kept talking about a fetus not being able to benefit from a SS number. I >> got the impression he thought we were talking about fetal cells. I >> don't >> think he knew anything about SCNT. He kept saying "life from conception" >> was the same as an actual life to opponents of ESCR which I think is >> their >> belief. His younger, cute wife has MS but only had one episode, is >> doing >> well and not on meds. He informed me all people with MS were different, >> I >> told him it was the same with us PWP. maybe if his wife gets worse, he >> will >> listen more carefully and maybe I am wrong, but lots of people really >> don't >> know we are talking about cellular "life". >> >> I still wish some of our List members who favor Bush's policy would speak >> up. Otherwise we can only guess. I have argued with 'pro-life" folks who >> empathize that a blastocyst is human life even though they shy away from >> the term "a' human life or person. They do equate it with adult persons >> I'm >> thinking because it is the stuff of life and people shouldn't be >> monkeying >> with it, but IVF is OK - it is a miracle from God.. Like the theory of >> evolution, I do think the RR in some way think it threatens their >> religious >> beliefs which I totally do not understand. >> Ray >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Ted Menser" <[log in to unmask]> >> To: <[log in to unmask]> >> Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 7:47 AM >> Subject: Re: 60 Minutes Surplus Embryo Report page 1 >> >> >>> This is not my opinion so please don't start an argument with me. >>> Sometimes >>> the expression "Don't shoot the messenger" seems to apply here. So at >>> the >>> risk of getting "shot," for clarification's sake, I think the objection >>> of >>> a >>> lot of a lot of the Religious Right (among other things that they have >>> been >>> called) is not what ultimately happens to the embryos but what may >>> ultimately happen as a result of embryonic experimentation. In order >>> words, >>> once it begins, where will it lead? At least this is what I have been >>> told. >>> It applies to both ends of the age spectrum. Don't "euthanize" the >>> elderly >>> and don't experiment on embryos (two vulnerable and often helpless >>> populations) because it will open the door to other things that may have >>> more sinister motives and uses. >>> >>> Disclaimer: Again, I'm just stating what I have gleaned. This is NOT >>> necessarily my personal opinion. >>> >>> Carole M. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Amanda Phillips" <[log in to unmask]> >>> To: <[log in to unmask]> >>> Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2006 3:05 PM >>> Subject: Re: 60 Minutes Surplus Embryo Report page 1 >>> >>> >>>>I still don't get it , why is using the surplus for research worse >>>>than >>>> letting them rot ? >>>> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> To sign-off Parkinsn send a message to: >>>> mailto:[log in to unmask] >>>> In the body of the message put: signoff parkinsn >>>> >>>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To sign-off Parkinsn send a message to: >>> mailto:[log in to unmask] >>> In the body of the message put: signoff parkinsn >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To sign-off Parkinsn send a message to: >> mailto:[log in to unmask] >> In the body of the message put: signoff parkinsn >> >> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > To sign-off Parkinsn send a message to: > mailto:[log in to unmask] > In the body of the message put: signoff parkinsn > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- To sign-off Parkinsn send a message to: mailto:[log in to unmask] In the body of the message put: signoff parkinsn