Bruce, Maybe we should talk a little about suicidal tendencies. Been there, Done that , is not enough. Yes, I have made at least 2 attempts in my life. One while in college at age 19 and again not that long ago. I have struggled with people telling me how terrible suicide is and how hard it is on those who are left and that is selfish on the part of the committed person. However, why should I live in absolute misery and pain so that you, my children and others can be happy?? What kind of answer is that?? A little over 3 years ago, just before I was finally diagnosed with pd, I was at one of those points in my life. I finally turned to a friend who is an LCSW (licensed clinical social worker with a masters in psychology). She counselled me. The first thing she talked with me about was not how my possible suicide would effect others, but what I want for myself. She focused on me, a thing I had not been able to do. You see, many people who are considering or committing suicide, are not thinking of themselves. At least not in a positive way. Because of my own experience I tend to talk with depressed people from a different angle. don't forget how to laugh (and do it often) Marling McReynolds [log in to unmask]