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Norm... I think a good reference for your friend would be sharing our own personal experiences with 'em. I'm not sure if the Canadian counterpart of our U.S. Social Security Administration consider anecdotal TRUE stories as being acceptable as evidence, but it worked for ME here in Los Angeles when I took a bunch of original, personal statements about living with PD written BY several persons having the disease and gave 'em to the Social Security judge at my initial hearing. Originally I'd planned to use these statements as a last resort 'cause I wasn't sure of their value as a reference. However, they really impacted with the previously EXTREMELY hostile judge. As he read, he kept saying, "I had no idea.... I had no idea...." In other words, it appeared as if the truth of ONE individual's terrible life-experience with PD (mine, at that time) didn't affect his thinking, but the truth of MANY people's miserable experiences had kind of a "collective effect" up the judge's bean-counter-type mentality. NOW - back to your original question.... I went undiagnosed for seven years before one MD FINALLY listened to me when I told him what my admittedly vague - but nonetheless uncomfortable - symptoms were. Since I initially began experiencing these symptoms at age 32, there was a "medical-knee-jerk-reaction" with previous MD's I'd been to (six over seven years) trying to get a diagnosis - THAT was "IF you weren't so young I'd say you have Parkinson's Disease." In fact, the MD who finally did diagnose my having PD said the same thing as he made his diagnosis. Barb Mallut [log in to unmask] ---------- From: Parkinson's Information Exchange on behalf of Norman Ichiyen Sent: Thursday, April 16, 1998 5:28 AM To: Multiple recipients of list PARKINSN Subject: Syptoms prior to formal diagnosis A fellow support group member is trying to appeal a decision in Canada for getting a disability pension for her husband who has PD. She needs referenceable material that relates to the length of time that symptoms can be present before a formal diagnosis is made. Her point is that her husband was affected by the PD well before a formal diagnosis and this had impacted his ability to pay into the Canadian pension fund. I have searched the Internet for some references but there is little documentation about the onset of Parkinsons before formal diagnosis. Can any of you help to identify references she can find and bring to her husband's pension hearing? Norm Ichiyen, Ruth Ichiyen (PD), 49/7