Anybody who's heard me on about this before should tune out now. Remembering Whitman . . . do I repeat myself? Very well then, I repeat myself; I am large, but I apparently contain only One Big Idea. Here I go again. > Am I reading correctly, Russ, when I understand you to be saying, > above, that the academic essay is typically "entirely without > authentic, instrinsic purposes"? If that is more or less what you > intend, could you elaborate a bit? Or have I misunderstood? Yes, I think you're reading correctly, that's just what I mean. And the reason I say it is that the academic essay is read only by one person, and that person is not (is certainly not seen by the writer as) in a dialogic relationship with the writer. She's assessing and helping; she's not being informed, being persuaded, being engaged. Nor, even if she were, and even if the student believed it, is she the appropriate _rhetorical_ audience for that essay. If a student were writing _to me_, she'd write something _very_ different from the essay she actually wrote. If she were writing to inform some general audience, she'd write something else again. What she's doing is writing an _example_ of public discourse, which will never be public (except perhaps as an example). There is no (real) audience for the rhetorical artifact of the student essay. What we do, of course, is _pretend_ there's an audience ("out there in chairs," as Anthony Pare says). The students who get the good marks, and who learn from the exercise, are those who can pretend in effective ways. Those who can't, can't learn from trial and error because the trials and errors have no authentic connections, and because what they're really trying to do (get a good mark) is different from the ostensible rhetorical purpose of the essay. > The second part of the sentence is a bit puzzling as well. Are you > distinguishing between (inauthentic?) writing that is written "to > demonstrate knowledge or ability" and, on the other hand, writing > that "persuades, amuses, engages, informs, etc."? As if the two > purposes and intentions were mutually exclusive? And the academic > essay falls into the first camp? Or have I misunderstood you here > again? I don't necessarily mean "the academic essay" here, I guess: what I'm talking about might better be called the _class_ essay, the essay written as part of an assignment to demonstrate either knowledge of a subject or skill at an analytic activity or discourse form. Such an essay can be _stipulated_ to have some rhetorical purpose. "Write an amusing essay," perhaps? No. "Write a persuasive essay." That's better. But no one is going to be _persuaded_ by that essay; someone's going to judge it as a successful example of persuasion, or not. So the student never has the experience of having wanted to persuade someone, and succeeding (or wanting to, and failing). She has the experience of having a professor as examiner try to explain why his judgement is that it was, or wasn't, an example of successful persuasion for some third party. > My questions are not, obviously, unmotivated. To begin with, an > academic essay that is persuasive and engaging, as I understand it, > may often also demonstrate knowledge and ability. And it might be a > better academic essay if it accomplishes several of these goals. "An essay that is persuasive and engaging" can't, if it's an essay for a class, be one that has actually persuaded or engaged . . . but it _can_ be one that demonstrates knowledge or ability. I'll buy that last sentence ("it might be a > better academic essay if it accomplishes several of these goals"), for sure -- what I'm questioning is whether, given the way academic essays exist, we can ever get past someone's judgement that that essay is or isn't a good example of persuasion. My students regularly come into my class, never, ever, having had the experience of writing extended discourse in order to inform, persuade, amuse, or present themselves to someone they care about informing, persuading, amusing, or presenting themselves to, and either succeeding or failing. My central aim as a teacher is to offer them that experience. Academic or class essays aren't a tool I can use for that. -- Russ __|~_ Russell A. Hunt __|~_)_ __)_|~_ Aquinas Chair St. Thomas University )_ __)_|_)__ __) PHONE: (506) 452-0424 Fredericton, New Brunswick | )____) | FAX: (506) 450-9615 E3B 5G3 CANADA ___|____|____|____/ [log in to unmask] \ / ~~~~~~~~~~~~ http://www.StThomasU.ca/hunt/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~