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Bruce, there was no need to apologize, I was just calling it as I saw it. And, I was getting convinced, I might be wrong, to an extent. Meanwhile I just heard of a woman who is riddled with cancer because her HMO doc did not spend enough time making a diagnosis, and told her to go home and stop being a pest, but in kinder words. NOW she is talking to lawyers. So if the HMO can't afford to pay it's doctors to do a thorough job, how will they find the money to pay lawyers, and the damages they demand for the patients? I already know the answer: the remaining patients and their employers will end up paying. When the cost of care provided by an HMO is as much as other options, the HMO's will go out of business. Who wants to pay gourmet prices for fast food? Not I! Ken B