Hi Carole, this is why I'm pushing for a discussion.  My high school
students used to do it, why can't we?  I think the folks with the IVF
connection have an interesting and valuable take on it.
Ray---- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Menser" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 8:02 AM
Subject: Re: 60 Minutes Surplus Embryo Report page 1/Carole


> Hi Ray --
> I guess everyone has their hot button issues.  I wish someone would hit on
> something that could bring the sides closer together -- or at least be a
> strong talking point.  As you point out, there needs to be some forceful
> and
> respected voices to help clarify some of the issues.  Like with that
> statement about Social Security, things get way off a lot of times and
> before you know it, the arguments are just plain ridiculous.  Everyone has
> to follow their own conscience but I hope there will be more
> enlightenment --on both sides-- about some of the polarizing issues.
>
> Carole
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "rayilynlee" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 11:12 AM
> Subject: Re: 60 Minutes Surplus Embryo Report page 1/Carole
>
>
>> Carole, I think this is definitely one of the objections.  They suffer
>> from
>> what I call the "fear of Frankenstein syndrome" .  The slippery slope
>> objection  which is fed by the Hwang fiasco., movies and books.   Also, I
>> think that mixing it with the abortion issue will make it easier to
>> overturn
>> Roe v. Wade.
>>
>> Last night I had discussion with my tax guy, a "moderate Republican" who
>> favors ESCR and a woman's right to choose.  I couldn't get a word in, but
>> he
>> kept talking about a fetus not being able to benefit from a SS number.  I
>> got the impression  he thought we were talking about fetal cells.  I
>> don't
>> think he knew anything about SCNT.  He kept saying "life from conception"
>> was the same as an actual life to opponents of ESCR which I think is
>> their
>> belief.  His  younger, cute wife has MS but only had one episode, is
>> doing
>> well and not on meds.  He informed me all people with MS were different,
>> I
>> told him it was the same with us PWP.  maybe if his wife gets worse, he
>> will
>> listen more carefully and maybe I am wrong, but lots of people really
>> don't
>> know we are talking about cellular "life".
>>
>> I still wish some of our List members who favor Bush's policy would speak
>> up.  Otherwise we can only guess. I have argued with 'pro-life" folks who
>> empathize that a blastocyst is  human life even though they shy away from
>> the term  "a' human life or person. They do equate it with adult persons
>> I'm
>> thinking because it is the stuff of life and people shouldn't be
>> monkeying
>> with it, but IVF is OK -  it is a miracle from God..  Like the theory of
>> evolution, I do think the RR  in some way think it threatens their
>> religious
>> beliefs which I totally do not understand.
>> Ray
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Ted Menser" <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 7:47 AM
>> Subject: Re: 60 Minutes Surplus Embryo Report page 1
>>
>>
>>> This is not my opinion so please don't start an argument with me.
>>> Sometimes
>>> the expression "Don't shoot the messenger" seems to apply here.  So at
>>> the
>>> risk of getting "shot," for clarification's sake, I think the objection
>>> of
>>> a
>>> lot of a lot of the Religious Right (among other things that they have
>>> been
>>> called) is not what ultimately happens to the embryos but what may
>>> ultimately happen as a result of embryonic experimentation.  In order
>>> words,
>>> once it begins, where will it lead?  At least this is what I have been
>>> told.
>>> It applies to both ends of the age spectrum.  Don't "euthanize" the
>>> elderly
>>> and don't experiment on embryos (two vulnerable and often helpless
>>> populations) because it will open the door to other things that may have
>>> more sinister motives and uses.
>>>
>>> Disclaimer:  Again, I'm just stating what I have gleaned.  This is NOT
>>> necessarily my personal opinion.
>>>
>>> Carole M.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Amanda Phillips" <[log in to unmask]>
>>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2006 3:05 PM
>>> Subject: Re: 60 Minutes Surplus Embryo Report page 1
>>>
>>>
>>>>I still don't get it , why is using the  surplus for  research worse
>>>>than
>>>> letting them  rot ?
>>>>
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